[Read kindle] El beso de la mujer arañaAuthor Manuel Puig – Cheapnikeshoes.co

Sometimes They Talk All Night Long In The Still Darkness Of Their Cell, Molina Re Weaves The Glittering And Fragile Stories Of The Film He Loves, And The Cynical Valentin Listens Valentin Believes In The Just Cause Which Makes All Suffering Bearable Molina Believes In The Magic Of Love Which Makes All Else Endurable Each Has Always Been Alone, And Always Especially Now In Danger Of Betrayal But In Cell Each Surrenders To The Other Something Of Himself That He Has Never Surrendered Before


15 thoughts on “El beso de la mujer araña

  1. says:

    More than anything, this book gets me excited about the possibilities of writing Puig revolutionizes the way the novel is framed his awesome work is a play, a stream of consciousness, a historic document, a research paper, a review of films it s ALL these things in one poignant EXTREMELY hard to put down novel The two main characters Molina, the sad, deceitful complex Spider Woman, who lures and tests the headstrong Valentin hold entire worlds inside of them They are both outcasts, tragic creatures, perhaps two of the most human characters ever devised in these terrains The story seems to go nowhere and then also everywhere Symbols abound, explanations like the Freud footnotes are sometimes completely irrelevant yet try to explain something we could have ourselves observed in less complicated terms I beg to compare this to Of Mice and Men , to that relationship between strong male But this one is better.This is one of my favorite novels ever.PS The Broadway production of Spiderwoman is one of the most underrated plays in ALL of human history


  2. says:

    What are you reading Kiss of the Spider Woman Hey, I ve heard of that Likely because of the movie that was made of it How is the book Fantastic Essentially all dialogue, but somehow all the descriptive for it Huh You gonna finish those fries


  3. says:

    So funny thing, I actually started this book once when I was a kid, maybe about nine years old Strangely, I thought I remembered what I d read really clearly, but then on this rereading realized I d read of it before than I d previously realized Also funny, my passion for this book waned around the same place this time as when I was nine, though this time I stuck with it and followed through to the end.So this book takes place in a Latin American prison cell occupied by a political prisoner and a window dressing, mama adoring homosexual The beginning, and much of the novel throughout, is the gay guy recounting old films he s seen, in incredible detail.Okay So All you English majors out there probably know what these are called, the fantastical, shimmering stories within stories that are so much purely imaginative and sensual and far out than the main story itself ever could be you know what I mean, like the interludes in Don Quixote and Judy Blume s Starring Sally J Freeman as Herself and Margaret Atwood s Lady Oracle and a thousand other books I can t think of right now There s something about those kinds of stories that I really wish I could get at here, but I probably can t What are they like They re like the icing, but you can t just eat the can of icing not that I haven t, but it isn t good, or it is, but it makes you nauseous The stories are like the silk rose on your underpants, but you can t just have underpants made up of silk roses They re the non porn sex scene, the roller coaster drop, the hook of the song, the cherry on the sundae, the beauty mark, the car detailing, the best part of the show I know these are super lame, useless, pedestrian analogies, but I ve been wanting to write this review for days and the right words just haven t come, so in the end I thought I d just say what I could and appeal to you all for help Do you guys know what I mean I mean the thing that is the best thing, but you can t have it just alone, because it isn t good by itself You can t have just holidays all the time every day, they don t mean anything without the mundane regular days in between. These stories within stories are like that I know writers have tried to do away with the dull base as much as possible Chaucer springs to mind and just have the stories, but it isn t the same rush and delight Why is that Well, I guess some of that s extremely obvious The films in this book are so beautifully told that it s a just a pure pleasure to read them, but what makes them so compelling is knowing these characters and experiencing what it is to consume these narratives both directly yourself, but also through them The first film in here, an erotic horror movie about a panther woman, I remembered clearly from my childhood reading of this book, and this time I realized that back then I got partway through the second film, which is a completely over the top Third Reich propaganda romance, before the nine year old me got freaked out and confused by the Nazi element, and bored with the two grown man prisoners, so then bailed for a Sweet Valley High or something.Anyway, I just loved the first half of this book In my scoring system, a four star book is one I think about when I m not reading it and am always excited to pick up, while a three star is one I have to push myself a little to return to sometimes, out of a sense of obligation and desire to get through Kiss of the Spider Woman shifted from a four to a three about midway through, which had not a little to do with the footnotes.Footnotes in fiction well, we should not speak ill of the dead, and sometimes they re good, but in general they are not always my favorite thing Especially here The footnotes here felt like the total opposite of those sugary, thrilling stories in story they were the sand in the spinach, the fly in my soup Who was supposed to be writing these footnotes At first I thought it was like an annotated transcript compiled by the jailers, but that wasn t it Will someone who s read this please explain what the hell these Freud and Marcuse footnotes about the etiology of homosexuality were about Because I just really didn t get it at all Was he trying to make an analogy between homosexuality and Marxism For awhile it seemed like that was where he was going Was Puig trying to say that commies are fags Because I ve heard that before, and I m not sure he needed all the psychoanalytic footnotes to say it, he could ve just had a mean fratboy pop his head in the cell and make that point I mean, I don t know, maybe I m just cranky, because I don t think that s necessarily a bad point if that was where he was going with it, but I can t help it, the footnotes just really screwed things up for me Maybe I m too dumb and impatient, I don t know, but I just found them distracting and incomprehensible And it sucks when you re reading something and you just don t get it So yeah, maybe it s my own fault, but the footnotes were a huge problem for me, and really yanked me out of the narrative, which was sad because for the most part I really did love this book.Oh yeah, so far this isn t much of a review I did really like this book, which is beautifully written, and I d love to see the movie, which I bet is good, especially since this reads like a script or actually scripts It was a lovely thing to read right after Darkness at Noon, and I feel it d be a nice segue to Our Lady of the Flowers, but I m not sure I m up for that right now Kiss of the Spider Woman is one of the most romantic books I ve read, and it made me realize yet again what a sucker I am for romance novels If you, too, are secretly enad of love, movies, and or storytelling, you should probably read this I liked what I personally took Puig to be saying about love, which might be that love is a childish fallacy, a campy pasteboard concoction, a screen for vile propaganda, an escape, a distraction, a desperation, a helpless Freudian outgrowth from early childhood but also it s everything In the end, it s all there is And maybe that s corny and not what he meant, but that s what I got, and I ll buy it.I m really sad because I read Rachel s gorgeous edition with the spectacular movie cover of the lovely blue Spider Woman with her ferns and her web, and it s not an option on here, and it s so beautiful I can t even stand it Can anyone fix that


  4. says:

    Chi non sa ricevere un meschino anche perch non gli piace dare niente Storia di un incontro di anime in cattivit.Valentin, dissidente politico, e Molina, omosessuale accusato di corruzione di minore, si ritrovano a passare forzatamente tempo insieme in quanto coinquilini in carcere.Niente apparentemente sembra accomunarli se non la condivisione della stessa cella E la necessit comune di far passare il tempo La necessit di spezzare la solitudine e di superare le paure ancestrali, condividendo le reciproche tristezze, quelle che si sentono in petto e in gola, quelle che hanno quel sapore amaro cos intenso Sono molto stanco, Valent n Sono stanco di soffrire Tu non sai, mi fa tutto male dentro Dove ti fa male Dentro il petto, e in gola Chiss perch la tristezza la si sente sempre l E cosa pu aiutare ad allentare le tensioni se non il raccontarsi una storia Il cinema.La magia del cinema trasporta, attraverso le parole di Molina, in un mondo immaginario costellato di vamp, donne bellissime, situazioni surreali, donne pantere, zombie, che sollevano l anima e lo spirito dei due reietti.Ma soprattutto, consentono a Molina e Valenin di scambiare posizioni e punti di vista sulla vita, sull a, sulla politica e sul sacrificio per difendere i propri ideali, sulla propria identit reale e sociale.Forza e tenerezza.Ribellione e sottomissione.Due personalit agli antipodi provano a comprendersi, per sostenersi reciprocamente E in quello spazio tempo sospeso e non corrotto dalle convenzioni sociali, costellato di favole da cinema, accade ci che diversamente sarebbe potuto capitare altrove Una contaminazione totale e reciproca delle due personalit E promettimi un altra cosa che ti farai rispettare, che non permetterai a nessuno di trattarti male, n che ti sfrutti Perch nessuno ha il diritto di sfruttare nessuno Ma, contro ogni aspettativa, sar il pauroso Molina, donna ragno, ad indicare la strada all apparentemente impavido Valentin.Inconsueto, commovente, scritto in modo straordinario.Finalmente una lettura entusiasmante.


  5. says:

    Ya han pasado d as semanas desde que le esta novela y a n no s si es buena o mal, pero me gust , as que supongo que eso es lo que cuenta.Resulta loable conseguir construir una historia solo con los di logos de los personajes, sin descripciones u opiniones de un narrador Por otro lado, gran parte de dicha historia es una persona cont ndole a otra la trama de varias pel culas reales, que s , sirve para caracterizar a los personajes, pero a n as , sigue siendo describir el guion de peliculas que ya existen.Aunque ha envejecido un poco mal en algunos de los puntos sobre la homosexualidad los extractos sobre la misma desde varios puntos de vista, es una novela en s misma , la verdad es que esta novela trata de combatir t picos que exist an en la poca en la que se escribi y en general tiene buena intenci n, as que no es realmente un problema.No s hasta qu punto los experimentos estil sticos los pensamientos sue os de los personajes y los textos dieg sicos de an lisis de la homosexualidad funcionan, pero debo admitir que la trama y los personajes me atraparon, y la historia me interes y me emocion Y eso es suficiente.


  6. says:

    Te imaginas una historia donde pones a un preso pol tico compartiendo celda con un homosexual Un rojillo y un travesti S , algo as Te lo imaginas S Y de hecho, m s que imaginarlo, eso ya lo he le do Y qu tal Bueno, pues as como lo planteas, de entrada, no suena mal, pero no le est s haciendo justicia a la novela, al autor Por Bueno, as como lo planteas dejas de lado muchas cosas Pero es que s lo es una pregunta detonante De todas maneras, no transmites la indiferencia del uno al principio, la emoci n del otro por contar y contar pel culas y de socializar, de involucrarse, dejas de largo c mo la indiferencia se va convirtiendo en amistad y fraternidad y otras cosas m s, y muchas otras cosas m s Bueno, s , pero no resulta tan f cil plantear todo eso en una sola l nea, en una primera l nea En una nica pregunta detonante Dejas de lado las historias de c mo llegaron all , el por qu , y a d nde quieren ir a dar y dejas de lado la t cnica peculiar en la que est escrita toda la novela, y que a n as , podr a pasar por ensayos sobre la homosexualidad, sinopsis de pel culas y, entre otras cosas, sin dejar de lado la historia de los protagonistas, sus inquietudes y dem s y todo eso Ah, bueno es que yo s lo quer a empezar el planteamiento No, no, pues hay que ser m s cuidados al plantear planteamientos para que no andes dejando tantos cabos sueltos y hagas una rese ita superficial con toda tu palabrer a Bueno, es que tampoco se trata de hacer la s per rese a Ya, ya s Es s lo con la intenci n de que la rese illa tuya d un aire de de qu va la novelita S , eso mismo Eso mismo y nom s Eso mismo y nom s Bah Qu Flojo.


  7. says:

    Bin fark l filmini ve tiyatrosunu izledikten sonra dedim bari kitab n okuyay m da onu da be enmeyim ama inan r m s n kitab ne g zel Bir sard m b rakm yor Ben anlamad m yani, nas l bu kadar g zel bir kitab bu kadar berbo uyarlamalar olabilir ya Yani bilerek irkin uyarlam lar gibi nk kitap zaten diyalog diyalog ak yor, neyi k t yapabilirlerdi ki diyorsun okurken.Neyse efendim, kitap, ayn h creyi payla an iki erkek aras nda ge iyor Biri siyasal su lu, di eride k k ocuklar sap k emellerine alet etti i i in girmi i eri Geceler boyunca biri di erine filmler anlat yor filmi anlatan tabiki gay karekter, ya ne olacakt , hastalan yorlar, z l yorlar ama hep bilikte ve anlat lan filmlerle bir nefes buluyorlar Hastal kta, sa l kta beraberler yani Birde nereye gitsinler zaten h crede ad m atsan kuyru un di erine arpar, sonu ta k kadar yer Ara ara sayfalarca s ren dipnotlarla, e lendirirken bilgilendirmeyi de iar edinen yazar m z, e cinsellik zerine retilen tezler ve onu r ten antitezlerle homofobikleri de bir g zel payl yor.


  8. says:

    I think I must have been in my mid or late teens when I came across the movie adaptation of this novel on TV I don t remember much about it, only that the movie must have just started and that I recognised William Hurt and Raul Julia, and that I was immediately drawn in by the chemistry between the two I looked the movie up just now and was surprised to find that they actually filmed the movie scenes that Molina Hurt relate from memory to Valentin Julia All I recall from the movie is the two of them talking.In the novel, that s basically what takes place Two people are stuck in a prison cell together, and they talk Molina is serving eight years for the corruption of a minor He is what I now recognise as a trans woman, but to the Argentinian authorities he is simply a sexual deviant I use the pronoun he because that s how Molina is seen by most characters in the book, and consequently the pronoun the author uses Valentin is imprisoned for being a political deviant, a left wing extremist Personally he sees himself as fighting for a just cause.Molina wants only to live as a woman, and to love and be loved, but also believes that to be a woman is to submit to a man and to center your life around him Valentin believes that having strong attachments is a liability that will make it harder to do what needs doing and make the necessary sacrifices But he also believes that relations between a man and a woman need to be on equal terms.To pass the time in their cell, Molina narrates from memory his favourite movies while these two disparate prisoners slowly get to know each other Movie scenes, cell life, and past life weave in and out of each other, and it is sometimes difficult to distinguish which of the two characters is responsible for a stray thought Somewhat oddly the book also contains footnotes detailing the various theories around the cause of homosexuality and how it relates to sexual repression and control The Freudian parts were bonkers, but I found the later discussions of bourgeois homosexuality and the subjugation of women rather fascinating and very much in thread with my own personal rejection of formal marriage, but that s another story I m still not entirely sure the footnotes fit in with the book, or what exactly Puig was going for with their inclusion except that at the time of writing homosexuality was widely viewed as mental illness and illegal in most of the world And Puig seems very much ahead of his time I spent most of the book wondering how it would all play out in the end and what the title had to do with anything And I could probably spend a long paragraph just discussing the ambiguous nature and imagery of the title, but that would be a spoiler.In short recommended, and I would like to read by Manuel Puig.


  9. says:

    E fantastico il potere di una parola Pube angelicale E cosa c di male se uno debole come una donna Perch un uomo o chiunque, un cane, o una checca, non pu essere sensibile se ne ha voglia Non so, ma a un uomo esagerare in quel senso pu essere di ostacolo Per cosa Per torturare No, per farla finita con i torturatori Argentina, 1974 Due uomini, diversi per carattere e stile di vita, si ritrovano compagni di cella Valent n lotta in clandestinit contro il regime militare, studia ogni giorno per non dimenticare i suoi ideali politici e rimanere fedele ai suoi valori di libert e uguaglianza tra tutte le persone, indipendentemente dal genere e dall orientamento sessuale Molina un omosessuale, una donna nata per sbaglio nel corpo di un uomo, che anela a un ideale di femminilit incarnato dalle dive degli anni quaranta eroine conturbanti e sottomesse ai desideri dell uomo che amano, per il quale sono pronte a rinunciare a tutto Cat People 1942 Il primo film che Molina racconta a Valent n.L angusto spazio della cella e la solitudine spingono i due uomini a trovare un terreno comune Molina intrattiene Valent n raccontandogli le trame dei film che pi ha amato per entrambi diventa il primo passo verso una conoscenza profonda che si trasforma in un amicizia intima e autentica O, utilizzando le categorie psicoanalitiche cui lo stesso Puig fa esplicito riferimento, si assiste alla nascita di un IO a cui contribuiscono entrambi i protagonisti, ciascuno portatore prevalente di un altra istanza psichica ES per Molina, SuperIO per Valent n diventa quindi possibile vivere le passioni e porsi degli ideali senza esserne distrutti, anche se solo nello spazio limitato della cella Kiss Of The Spider Woman 1985 , film vincitore di molti premi tra cui l Oscar per il miglior attore protagonista Il bacio della donna ragno un libro con una struttura particolare nessuna descrizione, solo dialoghi tra i due protagonisti oppure una forma di dialogo interiore con se stessi sotto forma di pensieri, sogni, incubi unica variazione sono i rapporti di polizia sui due detenuti, ma anche in questo caso si tratta di un dialogo tra lo scrivente e un interlocutore istituzionale Questa scelta narrativa che inizialmente mi ha lasciato perplessa non va a scapito della caratterizzazione dei personaggi o dell ambientazione l autore, infatti, opera a pi livelli e da quello esplicito le parole si passa all implicito, desunto dalle trame dei film e dalle note didascaliche sulla genesi dell omosessualit secondo la psicoanalisi, che sono sparse in tutto il romanzo anche se non hanno un legame diretto con la narrazione ma sono necessarie per capire il contesto sociale e la personalit di Molina, quindi vanno lette assolutamente.Herbert Marcuse, uno dei maggiori critici della teoria freudiana della sessualit.


  10. says:

    Kiss of the Spider Woman is a powerful psychological drama a dark chamber nocturne.Sometimes the entire state turns into a jail and then prisons become just a continuation of the state There are two men in a prison cell one is effete and the other is masculine, one is a seducer the other is a revolutionary, and each of them pursues his own benefit when they switch on a strong spotlight, the appearance of such a strange woman, with a long dress on, that s shining, Silver lam , that fits her like a glove yes, And her face she s wearing a mask, it s also silver, but poor creature she can t move, there in the deepest part of the jungle she s trapped in a spider s web, or no, the spiderweb is growing out of her own body, the threads are coming out of her waist and her hips, they re part of her body, so many threads that look hairy like ropes and disgust me, even though if I were to touch them they might feel as smooth as who knows what, but it makes me queasy to touch them, Doesn t she speak no, she s crying, or no, she isn t, she s smiling but a tear rolls out from beneath the mask Who is a spider and who is a fly Who is using whom And what is a price of a kiss


  11. says:

    Este libro es mi vida y lo digo en varios sentidos Es mi vida porque es la novela que eleg para hacer mi tesis de licenciatura, y en los anteriores seis meses as como en los posteriores, porque mi tesis va para largo la he estudiado profusamente, tanto su contexto como la t cnica narrativa experimental que abander Puig en casi toda su obra literaria Pero tambi n es mi vida en palabras o m s concretamente, la vida de mis emociones amorosas traducida en palabras Y la pregunta de rigor es Por qu una novela sobre dos hombres encarcelados, un revolucionario frustrado y un cuarent n homosexual puede traducir mi vida sentimental mejor que tratados o ensayos sobre el tema Quiz s porque el amor siempre me ha llegado como una niebla de palabras, vivencias, preguntas, donde nada es fijo ni tiene por qu serlo Porque el di logo vivo, tembloroso y en apariencias anodino de estos personajes me dice m s de las relaciones humanas y del amor que todos los estudios cient ficos y psicol gicos que he le do Qui n no ha sido Molina en el amor no correspondido Qui n no ha sido Valent n al ser privado del amor Puig utiliza los estereotipos del gay y del chairo ya en ese entonces era un tanto ridiculizada e idealista la imagen del luchador marxista y nos los entrega sin previo aviso, sin introducciones de un narrador Los deja hablar, y se nos van revelando a medida que hablan, tal y como se nos revelan las personas de carne y hueso que no son m s reales que las de papel Puig utiliza los prejuicios del lector hacia tales estereotipos para construir sus personajes Pero no hay que dejarse enga ar Molina y Valent n son de los personajes m s redondos de la literatura latinoamericana del s XX en la medida que no hay un narrador que los defina y esta misma no definici n es la responsable de que se nos aparezcan como entes trasl cidos, genuinos No hay atribuciones de di logo del tipo dijo , exclam , solloz , porque las palabras que emiten son lo suficientemente s lidas para necesitar matices de sentido Al principio me parecieron engorrosas las notas al pie, pero Puig escribe en un contexto donde la homosexualidad segu a vista como una enfermedad mental y el mismo cay en la trampa Pero eso no desmerita la novela porque nunca hay un discurso que dirija las ideas del lector La ausencia del narrador hace que el texto sean m ltiples novelas en una, y cada lectura es reciente como la primera Es, en definitiva, un libro que insto a leer a todos aquellos que han sentido el amor es decir, a todo el mundo Tambi n es bastante recomendable acompa arlo con otra lectura esencial Fragmentos del discurso amoroso de Roland Barthes Quiz s as nos podr amos hacer una idea, aunque sea parcial, del amor, en su compleja e inextricable inmensidad.


  12. says:

    In my opinion, Kiss of the Spider Woman is an exquisite novel, one I could not put down until the very last word To give away too much about this book is to spoil, so it will be just barebones here Set in Argentina in the mid 1970s, Luis Molina and Valent n Arregui are cellmates in a prison Molina, a gay window dresser, for corruption of a minor, and Valent n for being a Marxist guerilla who will not give over any information to the authorities Molina spends much of their time together recounting films he s seen, which at first seems like an escape mechanism, but as the novel progresses, it becomes very clear that there s much than passing time going on As Molina works his way through several movies, the reader begins to notice that they cover a wide range of themes, including political awareness, power, questions of identity and the true nature of the characters, sacrifice, betrayal, and the nature of relationships, but even importantly, they are all about different forms of repression and imprisonment The movies offer both prisoners a chance to begin serious and meaningful dialogue about their own inner anxieties, and their relationship becomes closer as they begin to open up to each other But of course there s than meets the eye here, leading to terrible, tragic consequences The films recounted by Molina in this novel provide great insight into various means of repression forced on others by outside forces it is also, in part, a story which examines the ways in which different people seek to transcend their own forms of imprisonment Obviously, there s much, much but this post just has to do for the time being While several readers have expressed misgivings about this book, in my opinion, it s one that should not be missed After reading the book, see the film absolutely amazing I can t begin to say just how much I loved this novel.


  13. says:

    I have read this book than 10 times Only one word can describe it Brilliant Forever one of my favorite books EVER A true masterpiece.


  14. says:

    Better than I thought it d be, very creepy and original It wasn t the most memorable book in the world, though.


  15. says:

    Maravilloso.